Depth Perception
Depth Perception

Episode · 2 months ago

On Bo Burnham's Inside ft. Lydia

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

This was recorded late in the summer of 2021, Leo and Randy are joined by Lydia for a discussion of Bo Burnham's Netflix special Inside. 

So we're talking about inside today. We're talking about Bo Burnham's two thousand and twenty one Netflix special inside. Yeah, yeah, yeah, two thousand and twenty one rand spank and new. I said, I I had thought it came out last year, but that wouldn't make sense. And as a special guest, we have maybe the biggest fan that I know of this special Lit Lydia Marino, my younger sibling, sibs, little sibster as they call them. That's good, Lydia. Would you like to say anything about yourself, distinguished guest, it's great to be here. What do you Marino? As a professor emeritus at Duquane University, as that true, a quiznos lecturer at the American Military University and a lover of yarn and even Universe, Stephen Universe, Bill Burnham Apparent, although I look marst how much I like it. Just telling Leo about how I'm not going to watch Stephen Universe. Why? They just look slippery. It's the same thing as it. Why? You? Sorry, okay, you'll never be gay then. All right, gatekeeper, gate keeper. Yeah, we got it, we got it. We got to be patient with Randy because eventually, eventually, something will get them in. It's why I'most almost got me yesterday. And when you do, when you do watch it, we can do a podcast about it. True, man, I'm saying. I mean I'm a really good podcaster, but I don't know if I'm that good the podcast about each episode. Each episode is of governments long. We can make an hour long podcast about each one. It probably honestly, it'd probably be pretty good for my career, I guess. Let's do it. So where do we start with this? I think we should start with Bo Burnham's special inside, because that's at the top of the page here. Yeah, and later we're going to be talking about forty six, that Dave Chappelle mini special. Yeah, we're briefly, since not everybody has reeve after you know, I know what. No, don't be crazy, because there's a third there's a third part we need you for. Okay, we'll see if it makes sense. If it doesn't make sense, I can I can just cut it. Yeah, it's just a brief mentioned as like a potential trend. Yeah, that was good. So okay. So what did you think about special? Did you did you like it? Anyway, I loved it. Okay, well, do you is the one who introduce used to to me too? Is that right? Yeah, yeah, I'm a big Fan. I liked it too. I think what was I think it was cool about it was that Bo Burnham managed to subvert my expectations about what it was going to be like just enough, just enough times, or well, really more than enough times. That like, for example, a good example, a good a good like kind of example. This is the the bit where he's like doing a reaction video to his own song and then it becomes a reaction video to the reaction video and loops a couple times. There's a couple moments where he talks about where he dares to like go into like express that kind of thought loop of like selfcriticism and then like, I don't know, praising himself for selfcriticism and then criticizing himself for praising himself, and I think that that's like really fits the sort of like inside theme, because I really feel like inside was just sort of the theme. You know, did a lot with that. Do you think it was funny? It was it funny? Yeah, I can tell you now. I did not laugh once. I had some good laughs. I remember laugh from when I watched it for the first time with you, Lydia actually, but not a lot. Cray. You laughed. I crack more crying laughing. HMM. There's some parts where I'm like, Whoa, it's just me, and it felt like it was just me and Bo Burnham. I did watch him more than once, though, and I will say so. I watched it and then I talked to a friend about it and he was like, Whoa, my one criticism is that there could have been more self reflection and connection to like real things that are happening in real problems, and I was like that's a valid criticism and I reflected on that and I watched it again and I decided. You know, I don't think that that's what the special is about, though. I think it's just an expression of Whan wans...

...and some of it gets really real. Some of it is just like some real dad stuff, though, and even if we're trying to look at our own experience during the pandemic and be like, Oh, I grew in this way, you know, this was a good experience, this part of it, like, I'm going to look at this part of it and say that that that was healthy for me. There's still a reality where we all really shitty parts where we were just really sad and like we're just kind of wondering if we would ever be able to be people again and what kind of long term effects this would have on us. And, you know, we're reckoning with all of the horrible things in the world that were like exacerbated like by the pandemic and Um, when I kind of brought that back to my friend they were like, yeah, I agree. I like it for what it is and I think I also laughed more when I watched it again after thinking about all of that. Yeah, it was more like epistemological. It was more like a diary than a typical like Bou Burnham special. I'm not a huge fan of Bo Burnham. I think comedy songs in general are usually pretty weak, but for the most part, yeah, I like the more sensitive second half of this compared to the like joke here first half. I mean I think that was like I think that's like an interesting way to show his progression, you know, as just as a person through the year. I mean there's a pretty stark tonal difference between the two, the two halves of this special. I really, I really wasn't on board with like the jokey stuff. I could have done with a bit more insight into them, into Bow Burnham. See. kind of agree with my friend. Yeah, definitely, I think. Yeah, the one that really sent me over the top was white woman's instagram. I really hated that song. I think the middle of it the well, that's what I'm that's when I'm getting at. There was like that middle part where she's talking about like well, he the playing the girl character, is, you know, talking about like, you know, mom, Tell Dad I love him, and like kind of implying that I feel like her parents were or something. Yeah, I was going to say content warning, the middle part where he's like talking about his mom, who is dead. Yeah, and a post about it. I thought that like how I felt doing that song. was like the beginning of it was just like making fun of a white woman's instagram and like the esthetics, and then there was that post and then that, after that post, I got like more uplifting and it was actually like oh no, like this is, you know, good for her. That's she's having a she's just trying to find beautiful things and like share them. That's that was the vibe that I got, but I was just kind of like weird. Yeah, I mean like there's like the artsy fart two way of looking at it, which is like how I'm going to choose to look at it. Like it's a story about like how a person finds himself, you know, in like kind of a cut and paste social media environment, right. The cut and paste aspect of it, I think, is like kind of sort of it's like kind of where Bo Burnham kind of comes from, you know, like a lot of his older songs. We're very free, associative and and I gotta just say Golden Retriever to flower crown, as in Nane and silly as it is, is one of my favorite lines in the entire special. It was so it was still on point. When laying there and when he's laying there and the pumpkins are projected onto him, I really was that he was probably trying to figure out how to project a pumpkin patch and then look like he was laying in it and then he was like wait, no, the pumpkins got projected onto me and then you just remember it and I was like that's great, I love that. That was so good. This. This did feel like a little. I mean obviously it was more of a production than than your usual comedy special. I like in this to like Kabuki or puppet theater later on in the document, but this was like more of a production, which is really cool. There was like an improvisational feel to it, which I think was important to the overall statement of the of the special. But I just don't know, I just don't know how I feel about calling it a comedy special. I think that's a weird way. I like it's like weird nomenclature for it. That's kind of what's that's that's one of the things that I think is going to we're going to come back to is that, like dobby, this is going to set the tone for a different kind of...

...maybe it'll be a one off. Maybe there would be imitators though, you know, maybe like there's more space for this kind of thing in the future. I think it was comedy. When I think about I don't like that many comics. Well, often I'm thinking of a comedy special that I watched that also was not really comedy special. You mind if I call have you ever heard of what was called them Douglas? MMM, remember her what's her name? Hannah, Hannah Gadsby. So she had two comedy specials that were on Netflix. There was Douglas and then there was another one I can't remember the name of, but it was like a one woman show kind of thing. And he said in her one of her specials, like I wanted to quit comedy, and that's because I realized that a lot of what I was doing, which is making fun of myself, you know, and I think a lot of comics do, that they're relying on Selfdeprea, deprecation and especially if you are have experienced I mean you could argue that everyone is experiencing trauma because we live in a capitalist society. But if you also, like, you know, she is, like identifies as lesbian and artistic, and if you are making fun of yourself and you have also, you know, experienced prejudicism and, you know, abuse because of the society that you live in, then that's like really bad for your self esteem to be making like a spectacle of yourself in that way. And I think that making a spectacle of the spectacle, like that's what Bou Vernham did. He made fun of the Shit that we are living in and it wasn't funny because it's so sad. But it was funny. That's how I feel. I'm like it was comedy. It's just like fucked up. How but he but I think it's funny because he was so good at like writing songs about it and making rhymes and putting it into words and doing the visuals. But it also is very expressive and like made me feel a lot of like sadness. Yeah, shout out to his cinematography. Also very, very creative, and it's so transparent a lot of it, because you're seeing the set, you're seeing you're seeing the camera literally, sometimes in the mirror or whatever he's holding the different camera. You're seeing how he sets up shots, you're seeing him do takes. I love that aspect of it because it's like, I don't know, and it doesn't take away from it somehow adds to like the effect when you're actually seeing it all put together, when you're seeing him with the projector on him in the lights and all that stuff. I really appreciate all all the be real and this. HMM. Yeah, and like the pickup shots where he's just talking into the mirror. I thought we really nice. Yeah, I don't know, I would like this more to like, like, did you guys watch the oblongs? I don't know if that's still on TV or anything. It's like a cartoon Sitcom. That was like, you know, it's like kind of a regular Sitcom, except it was like in the like Dystopian far future of America. Were like, you know, capitalism, capitalism has like exact extracted all the value possible from the world, and it was just a goofy Sitcom. I don't know. It like it's one of those things where, like, yes, it is funny, but there's just the kind of like niggling sense of like desperation the whole time. Hmm, I think that was a huge feature of this. You know what's funny actually is, you know, what was recommended to me by the Algorithm once I finished the special bow Jack Horseman, which is a show I actually haven't watched except for the first couple episodes, but I mean I've been meaning to watch and I feel like the way that we're speaking about this isn't that different from how I've heard people speak about that show. Very ugly show, you hate the look at that show. It's a horse, it's a horseman there, but there's something about that that show. Once again, it's like it's funny, but it's not funny. For me, it's the layer of removal from reality, because you're looking at these really fucked up characters that reflect very real fucked up traits of people who have been traumatized by capitalism and you're able to like laugh at it and also like process it because they're their cartoons and their animals. You...

...know. It just like makes it easier to get to the hot like you could not do that with a real people show. And I feel like him having the special and doing and just talking about all of this stuff in small doses, like in like a kind of goofy way, like when he's doing it with like Saco the that's how the world works, with the stock puppet. I'm like, I was going to bring up that song next to soulpin. Yeah, that was just kind of like a I don't know, I think it was a good way of unpacking these like feelings that I feel like a lot of people have collectively felt. Word. Yeah, I mean there is something appealing about bojack horseman, in the same way that there's something appealing about this. I mean I don't know, I find myself a little bit more sensitive than maybe I like I feel like I should be to like kind of like the struggling actor, you know, the starving artist situation. I think there's like some really sad human stories there and that's what got that's what like appealed to me so much about this kind of brings you in. Yeah, just because I mean it's it like sucks to say and like it makes me feel like a Weirdo or something, but like I definitely see myself in it. Doesn't make you seem like a Weirdo. Makes okay. Well, it makes me see myself as Weirdo. If I said that, it probably would have made me feel weird to say it too. But but like I relate. I mean, yeah, I mean I would, I would. I would definitely like clown on somebody that said it to me. But it's something, like something I feel. There's aspects of his character that I think we all feel, like of all the characters that we all feel, and their flaws are so exaggerated that the stuff, like the stuff that Bow Jack does do just become a bow jack horseman podcast. But like the stuff that Bow Jack does is not stuff that most people have done. It's like very extreme, very shitty, very ugly Um, but the way that he processes his flaws and falls into patterns of bad behavior and like the way that he like has expresses his trauma, I feel like it is something that that that feeling of like I feel shitty about myself, but I can't get my I can't keep my shit together either, and I don't know how to fix it. Like you're just constantly like slipping. I feel like that is like a very relatable feeling and also, because it was so exaggerated, it's easier. Like, you know, they really hit you over the head with it. Yeah, I mean, if I'm like going to be real, that's like the not superficial reason that I avoid that show. It's like, I mean, we're going to talk about Dachapelligan later, but like, you know, you watch this Po show or something. I didn't know if you either of you to have but I watched the first two episodes last night actually. Okay, so maybe maybe you don't feel the same way, but like I'll watch it and I'll be laughing. Like some of those episodes like really like make me howl. You know, HMM, but at the same time I'm like this is a little bit too real. I don't know if I can watch another one of these today. Like so, if you watch first episode, you would have seen the the what was it? What was his name? The character, Um takes me Clayton BIGSB. Yeah, yeah, the the Black Whit supremacist. Yeah, you know, I'm sure I'M gonna have to cut this, but like, I don't know, it kind of makes me think of somebody like, you know, candace Owens, somebody like that, you know, just figures and like situations that we see happen in real life. It's it like is a little bit prophetic in that way. It's just a it can be a little bit too real for me, which this special definitely got a little bit too real for me sometimes couple times. From me to were it kind of hit. Like I said, it was just me and me and Bo Burnham's talking at some part of me that doesn't usually get talked at by any media. You know, the kind of thing like I might if I might see a youtube video that's about some like topic that I might think like all that might be useful to me to work on myself or some shit, but then I don't click on it because I don't want to get stressed out. And this special just like drops you into those kind of moments a couple times without a lot of warning. You know what I mean. Mental health stuff, and the moment where he said he makes that joke about him just being totally unhinged. That scene, for he's like holding a knife and then back and he's, you know, going to give it. You guys give content warnings to the beginning of the episode, though, but but he goes back and he talks about like, you know, you shouldn't really, I was just joking, you shouldn't kill yourself and has a buckles...

...and then there's a scene of him looking like shit watching that back, as like whether it was him looking at it and being like, you know, that's fake, or it was him looking at it and being like I need to watch this because I feel bad. So I'm looking at this video of me telling other people that they should not do that and I feel like wow, I like miss that. That's so good. That's so good. It was so good. I feel like that was something that I had a I had a lot of I've always had like struggled with depression and like suicide ideation. So I feel like like watching that play out for him, watching him kind of lose it a little bit and that at that. Just thinking back on times during the pandemic row I was like, Oh wow, I lost it or I like talked, would talk to my neighbors and I would just be like yeah, like, you know, think I'm glad that you guys were down there because you're kind of kept me together, you know, like and really not kidding. When I said that and seeing that happen for him, I was like, Whoa, that's pretty there's no other way to show that. I think he really nailed that. Not that that's everyone's experience, but I think that the way he portrayed that was very good. Yeah, for sure they're. The scene that you were talking about was one of two times I watched this for the first time on Monday, at least the first time in full. I watched like the first hour last week. But Um, there was one of two moments where I had to like pause and like get away from the the show for a little bit because it I don't know, it just kind of felt like he was talking about me for a little bit. You know, if I I don't want to kill myself, but like if I could kill myself for like eighteen months, I would. I'd never heard anybody say that before, but I was like wow, I really relate to that. Like that, when he says that, like opens me up to like fantasizing, which is weird. But like I mean, well, I I've I've had I've done I've definitely had like moments where like all right, if I had the means right now, I would do it, and then it's like thirty minutes later and it's like, oh no, I just I was hungry or something like, you know, I didn't like I didn't get enough sleep, and now I'm actually awakened, like I'm thinking clearly or whatever. And then there was the part where he stopped, like it was right before Um, not gonna spoil anything, which is right before the best song in the whole show, all eyes on me, where he just like stopped and looking in the camera and's like I'm not well, God, Damn, Boh, fuck you pringles guy. And I just I had to stop. I had to like stopping, like I went outside and like I just had to pick myself up and after that. I don't know that that's that. I don't think. I don't think the special would have made it if that's what it was the whole time, if it was like that level of sensitivity the whole time, I don't think. I just don't think it would have made it to the Netflix at that point. But I would love to get, like I would love to get like a really like soft, like singing songwriter album from Bo Burnham, because he's like proved that he's got the chops. I'm just thinking that to this time around when I was watching it, give me an eighto weights and heartbreak or something. Bo I, some of just singing is so good. Like I didn't really think about as a singer before. This something that I felt a lot during the pandemic, especially because whenever I get in those moods where I feel very bad, I like you, you know, harmful things to myself. It is, and I don't know how much of that was real or in what way it was real for him, but it's real for a lot of people. Before the pandemic, during after. I feel like that feeling of looking at yourself and just being like this is so fucking stupid this feels so performative. Knowing that he filmed himself freaking out like that, I think, kind of really just does it for me. I'm like that fucking feeling of like like, kind...

...of like you're you literally feel like when it feels performative to do anything, like during the pandemic. So I've had it before where I'm like it feels like performative to have an anxiety attack. Even this feel so dramatic, but like my body needs this or to do x thing, you know, to myself. That feels performative. But I during the pandemic, would have it for things that were like selfcare. To it felt stupid to do anything good for myself because I was just alone and no one was even seeing it and I was so deeply depressed that I was just like what, what does it even matter? I feel like I am in a movie and someone is watching me, but no one is watching me. And then I would also feel that when I would do bad things, and that feeling that you are performing and someone is watching you, but no one's watching you and you're not really experiencing the experience. And I feel like that the him watching the video back of him talking about mental health while he's filming himself. Just that like those layers that like inception. It was just like really like nailed it for me that that just feeling of like disgusted and like just like like just annoyance at yourself that you're even feeling that fucked up. It's funny for me that this special, like it does not resemble my two and two thousand and twenty one experience at all. Instead, what it did is it reminds and for shadows to me of what's going to happen at what could happen when I get my shit together again. I've I mean I've had like, I don't know, I feel like my time during coronavirus and during, you know, the black lives matter movement last summer, and everything was really good for me and and I don't know that that was like sort of the that was like sort of the feeling that I left the special with is that like this is this is what it's like for me in the real world. HMM. Can we talk a little bit about the sort of the subtext of the whole like filming himself, filming himself thing and like you're talking about when he did the reaction video. Well, know just what video was just saying about he's filming himself, watching himself reassure other people. Okay, that not filming himself. Filming self is I thought what you meant is the real city. Okay, does I think he does it all the time, because there's a subtext of like this is like kind of what's always happening. The one of the most brilliant thing. Okay, so the line of the about the backlash to the backlash, the thing that's just begun, I think it's at another example of this, a little bit just like people reacting to people's reactions. It's a big theme, even if it's either you reacting to your own. I think he's kind of insinuating that this sort of that style of thinking and of experiencing the world kind of gets exacerbated by social media. And he also one point says like this is what we've always wanted about social media and general, and I think he's kind of right that like the level of like our anxiety, like we do crave that and it's being sold to us. When he says is zoomers are going to develop a disassociative personality disorder and then the little bit of everything all the time, just all of that thread. My friend J I was like you like the way that the Bo Burnham special was introduced to me? So I my friend had already been like Lydia, you need to read society of the spectacles. Society of the spectacle, that came up on the new weird studies today. Oh really, I have not read that, but I've watched a video about it and talked about it and I'm trying to finish my current book so I can read it. But he was like what do you gotta Watch it? It's a literally about the spectacle, and I think it is. It's about the spectacle, it's about that, it's about how we are controlled by media, by images of capitalism, and also when he's like, he's like, he says, like you say the ocean is rising, like I give a shit. Just stuff like that where it's like when you're like confronted with these larger issues that are happening in the world and you feel like you know that there's literally nothing we can do about it, the idea that we should even care about it, I mean on an individual level, in a in a way it in since you insinuates were supposed to try and...

...enact change. Is a lot of like consumer like responsibility propaganda like that. That message just gets like used to make us try to buy shit still, but just buy shit. And what's supposed to be the right way exactly like it like wooden tooth bread, and I'm calling myself out here because I use those but I think that kind of spectacle, that kind of like everything that we think. Our identities as a whole are controlled like their commodities. They are like not unique, they're totally intentional and we are living through these likes, images and these like phrases that we are told. And so that connection to like social media and the irony that that was the only thing to keeping us in touch with each other during the pandemic, I think is huge to like when he talks about sexting and facetiming with his mom and how fucking frustrating and horrible it is, but at the same time it's like necessary because we literally don't have anything else. There's like this really frustrating contrast that like, you know, you become more aware of it like as you grow up. You know, I I don't know if my timelines like all the way correct here, but I would compare it to like, you know, Italy, having to do with like you know, at the height of the renaissance, you get the plague right there's there's like this clash of like extreme decadence and also like imminent apocalypse that I think really is distilled in just a super exquisite way and inside one of my one of the couple things, but Idia on the thing that you were just talking about, how like we're all inside, but we're trying to stay connected with each other and in the times when he all, when he says this is what we've always wanted, I think that really rings. I think what he means is, like we created this world, like this was like the result, this was the natural result of like designing the ipad to do exactly what we wanted it to do, the whole thing. But it also means like we were like there's out there's an element of the pandemic and the Western world, which is like the Western developed, like technocratic society that we live in. We're like everyone has an iphone and like your life is like mediated through your iphone and shit like this is what we've always wanted in the sense that, like, we were all prepared for this, like our lives are online anyways right now. There was a there's times when I felt during the pandemic that, on a collective level, this was an excuse for everybody to just stay inside. Not that it wasn't Shitty, not that I didn't not that like, and I'm not saying like, obviously not everybody has access to that, but again, just like the collective mood that gets projected by the media, is all about like why it's important to stay inside, but didn't really talk about the fact that, like, a lot of people who were writing those articles had no real problems. Their lads were already all online. Yeah, it's easy for them. Yeah, it's interesting you said that, because the next thought I had after saying what I said was, like we could talk about the class experience of the pandemic and the fact that it's still going on, but it's not here, and the even talking about the pandemic seems fake. It's like these news articles that are circulated just to keep you thinking about it and be like remember, it's still here, but we all know that that's just like something to write about and if it came down to it. If we like had another outbreak, you know, or a new variant that was resistant to the vaccines, people would not stay inside. And it's interesting because I was on fucking instagram the other day and I saw this like from this meme account. was like a picture of all like the first ever case of monkey pox was discovered in a human indults Texas, who flew back wherever, and there's a comment underneath the said like just fucking and sacrifice him. We cannot do this again, and it's just that. And then I looked up monkey poks on Google and coock news and that article came up and it was like Washington Post being like all right, this does not pose any real threat. Please like remember that covid still poses a threat, a bigger threat than this does. And it's just funny because people are like willing to like be like, oh well, the pandemics over, that sure sucked, like let's make sure that doesn't happen again, when really, like there's a very real possibility that we all will need...

...to be staying inside again this winter, and there's certain people who will not accept that because to them it's over. It's done. For a lot of people, are never started where there's the people for whom, and I ever started in the people for whom it was totally like a mediated experience online. The pandemic was the way that people talked about it and like for those people, for the people, for those of us who, like are just it's just done, no matter what it's like. I'm not a hundred percent sure that I'm not one of those people, you know what I mean, because it depends on how much I'm willing to read and how much I'm willing to talk about it and how much the media is wanted to talk about it. But the PANDEMICA as a cultural phenomenon feels like it's going away, you know what I mean. And but that doesn't mean the pandemics actually done. It might mean that our there's a mismatch between what we thought of as the pandemic and what the pandemic actually is. And I sure there is a mismatch, because they're always is one. But the question is how dangerous, like how lethal, is that mismatch going to be, you know what I mean. What's the cost of that? Now I don't think we've begun to experience the reckoning from general irresponsibility through the last year and a half. On a later note, I think we should talk about some of the songs from the show, because it's kind of what I mean. That's what it's all about, is the songs at the end of the day, right, what was the song? where? What was the song where? Where he says that basically your relationship to the real world should be as a minor going out to collect resources to bring back. Now, just so little like intermittent comedy bit. I feel like that's some like society, the spectacle shit too. I love that, because he was sitting here pretending to do stand up naked, and then he was saying what I realized is our interactions with the real world just be in the nature of like going to get things, resources and bringing them back and then resuming our interactions online in the yeah, I think that's when he got the closest to just that's like the most succinct that he was about it. That was really smart to me. Yes, and I think the whole setting of that too, of him just pretending to do comedy and then this making some stupid ass joke after that. Yeah, that's when he says the thing about pirates right, which like what honestly, I did, like every song in its own way. That's how the world works, was really good. You know, that was a good way of like starting to be like, oh, we're going to talk about hard things, this is going to be hmm Um, mixed experience, and then you could tell, like as the months went by, is the songs went by, that it like got more and more intense. I think that's some of the best social commentary. And thing is is that moment with Sacho. I thought that was really good. I mean and he's obviously he's like I think. And of course the easy question, which is probably a little bit the wrong question, is like is Bo Burnham the communist? And I don't think that Bo Burnham is necessarily a communist. I've heard people, other people, say that he's maybe more of a libertarian. I don't think he's a liberal matter. Bill Burnham not only understands what it's willing to talk about these things, but more than being willing to talk about them, he's considered how to talk about them. As a comedian. That's sneeze that I would put on a soundboard. You can have it. I mean it's not it's recorded now you can have it. Thank you all the best things. Now I got to keep it in. Okay. Well, so, so the ow and I have talked to bit, like in small snippets of conversation, about how the world works. My Yeah, I have to say for like the third week and around, what you're talking about the song or the concept the the song song. So the other you're like me, and we have talked and small snippets about the apple world works like. So we talked about in huge snippets for a year. We've tried, we hope that I've been talking about it. So I've had to say it the last like four episodes in a row, but I've I've noticed that I'm extremely sensitive to Meta commentary, right, and so I've been wondering since I heard the song. I guess it would have. It's less than a week since I've heard the song for the first time, but I don't know. For me that, for me, the interesting part of the song to talk about is how well intentioned, like like well read, people are still extremely susceptible to wild conspiracy theories, which is something that we've had to reckon with a lot over the past year. So what do you think about the PEDOPHILIC corporate elite? Well, it's obviously talking about Jeffrey Epstein...

...and everybody that associated with him, Epstein, Weinstein, the nickelodeon Guy. Yeah, the powerful Dan Schneider. That his name, Dude. I mean he is, though. He's showing feet to the kids, man. I mean how it's like a pretty serious fucking thing that, like the guy that makes the knows a nickelodeon and was like a pervert, right, I did not know that. Yeah, it's been like a it's like pretty interesting to hear Janet mccurdy talk about her experience in Hollywood. She's like one of those child stars that seems to have like survived and good drived. It's ironic because the character they had her playing, you know, like I saw a meme the other day and it was like about that friend on every TV show that doesn't want to get all is always hanging around because they have a bad home life, and Sam, for my Carley, was one of them. And it's iron they're portraying her to is this like scrappy, kind of like more aware, traumatized character, and she actually is, like she is that in person, but like this the show where she portrayed that is, you know, probably one of the things that turned her into that right. HMM, that's true. Oh, real quick, on the way the world works. I think it's interesting also that he says pedophilip corporate elite, which obviously like, even if you're talking about specific actual people, that always rings conspiratorial. Can you queue and Oni and right wing, you know, even if you push it antisemitic. But what ends up making Boburn and pull the sock off his hand isn't talking about the pedophilic corporate elite, right, it's like talking about the genocides of people like I think that's when he's like, that's enough. Basically, yeah, I hope you learned your lesson. I didn't hurt. Yeah, yeah, I learned my I didn't that hurt. Did you learn your lesson that? Yes, I didn't hurt. Like that. That really that's when it gets like, whoa like, whether or not you're literally like obviously the people that sacco represents aren't literally socks on hands, but the idea being that the power that people have over them is enough to completely silence them and in the eyes of other white people, other powerful people, whatever, to render them basically as incapable of speaking in any white sanctioned space as they would be if they were just a sock boocket puppet taken off. I think is really good, really on point. The metaphor obviously breaks down if you look at it too closely, and I'm not trying to say that like white people control the avenues of speech for others, and I don't think Boburn I was saying that, although you could make that criticism if you want to get way in the weeds, but I think that I think that the feeling that I felt when he pulls the sock off of his hand is going to stay with me, as silly as it is, like something I watch that I'm like, I'm like wow, that's yeah, just the heartlessness of it. The one about holding holding them accountable one problematic. Yeah, problematic. Isn't anyone going to hold me accountable? There's such an issue in the world with holding people accountable. There's I both have criticisms of cancel culture as it functions because they think that it's like on the ground, it's useless. We shouldn't be canceling people because they do something wrong. If we are like interacting with them and friends with them and the like. In the realm of like canceling celebrities, literally, who gives a shit, because most celebrities are already probably a piece of shit. But Burnham's like somewhere in between a real person and a celebrity and he's just like, is anyone even going to notice that I did the shitty things? And I just think that's hilarious. It makes a perfect mockery of both cancel culture and the fact that we like do not know how to talk about Shitty things that we have done and hold each other accountable. Yeah, it's really interesting. I I feel like I've changed my opinion a little bit since we recorded our episode about cancel culture, but I think something that remains true is that when especially a celebrity, I don't I don't really know that if you can cancel regular people. I mean I guess it happened with like the bird watching incident last year, like the permit Patty. There was like the Karen from Victoria's secret that blew up recently. But canceling the celebrity has been it's almost like alchemy. You transmute one audience for...

...another. I mean you you just delete them from like other person's okay, and they're like they're like not problematic and like we maybe we can even make them better to like let's just give him to the right and let that become their sphere of influence, in the sphere that influences them. Right, because they have the means to. They have the means attract an audience. You can't take that away from like a youtube star, unless youtube literally, even if you tube de lease their account, they still have people looking for them. All they have to do is act on it and they're going to find an audience again, because the the like, the like potential to have an audience doesn't get canceled. The audience just changes. You're right. Unless they unless they take it on themselves to completely go out of the public eye, they're not going to go anywhere. It's easier to stick around. Yeah, just yesterday, I think, or maybe Monday, I guess it depends on whether today is the day. I think it is. But like marjory Taylor Green was suspended from twitter for like twelve hours or six hours or something recently. All that does that just like gives her something to talk about. It all. It literally all it does is like it's a glow for her as far as her fan base is concerned. It's the probably one of the best things that's happened to her since she got weirdly elected into office. She's the queue on one right, she's one of them. Yeah, sorry, yeah, sorry. She's one of the q one on ones. Yeah, I think there are all like degrees of q and on ones. Fair. So tell me about songs you like. What do you got? I know that your favorite one is the one that was also my favorite one. Randy, that funny feeling, but I love sequence of welcome to the Internet, Bassos to and that funny feeling. And I'm just going to quickly say welcome to the Internet is just a perfect encapsulation of what the Internet is, the chaos, like, the sounds, the visuals and the video, the creepiness, the good. So I watched this special in three settings. I wish it one and a half times in three settings, and the first time I really didn't like welcome to the Internet and by the time I got through the end of the special the first time you started watching again, it had clicked that it like has a place and it's important in the special and I got it. Yeah, I'm like, I'm I can hear, like, I can pop around to the sea shanty kind of thing. I I can appreciate like the like. It kind of sounds like a poke, I guess, or something. When Nice says all the colored pencil all the cars, characters in here, a potter fucking each other, I was like to real some deep tomb wor shit like this is that's so good, that's so specific and like random and and he completely breaks the rhyme and almost missed, like almost drops up rights. The fucking exists. No, I don't even know if he's ever seen that before, but you could. It's just to say that there's certain things about that's one of the things about the Internet is that there's just certain things that you know exist. Anyone who's ever had the experience of being about to Google a question and being like, I know this is going to get suggested when I type in three words and then it does. It's a similar that's like a lower level version of the same thing. I mean there's a reason that like rule thirty four is like the most famous Internet phenomenon ever. What is that? If something exists, there is porn for it. Oh yeah, yeah, one, you know, fat work and I'm but I'm glad that that's like. There was that song the Internet is for Porner. It was meme or something. I'm glad that's not what this song turned out to be and I'm glad that this song had something more to say. It was perfect, perfect makes and how he sometimes cuts himself off, like he starts his thought and then changes to something else, also captures that level of just like yeah, got a Buch of tabs open, you're not going to you know. Yeah, he really captures like their phrenetic energy of just being online. Right. You're just like I want something, I don't know what, and I'm ready for the interest it to suggest things to me. Yes, such a feeling. Yeah, I've had that feeling a lot during the pandemic. Second half the pandemic, I really start to feel myself like getting addicted to certain platforms and like we try to take a break and stuff. FACEBOOK, I had to get rid of it on my phone and that basically did the trick. But the problem as you always sort of substitute it with something else. You know, I've been addicted to youtube shorts lately. And I can feel my attention span like contracting. Well, and I hate...

...watching them. I I don't know if there's a dislike button, but I'm I would press it, but I don't because then they'll stop showing them to me. It's I don't know, he really really captures like the Stockholm Syndrome of like Terminal Onlineness, syndrome of Terminal onlineness. It's true, I also like Bezos two, mainly that social just annoying me because I've fucking Hate Jeff bezos. No, just like, just like that, like obviously mocking, like or gas makes sound, you're just like it's just kind of like is this what you want, Jeff Bezos? Is this the validation you need? I loved that too. That was I've been reading to. I've actually been have had that in the back of my head as something that I like wanted to specifically point out is just the feeling that song basically just like gives you the feeling of like just like the inverse of the feeling that you have when you hear about Jeff Bezos, of just like what the fuck, like of just like Yep, good job, you really did it. Like the fact that there's like three lines in that song, especially bezos two. I don't think that he has any verses, like it's just him vamping on the chorus and I'm just like yeah, yes, you did it, and then Jeffy berazils went in the space. Well, yeah, I guess I have to say it again. It's crazy. What divorce will they're doing? Guy, the guy, the head guy. He's the head Guy Right now. Yeah, man, yeah, it's gonna say. Look at that, it's very inside. Wow. Yeah, that's what it reminds me of. Yeah, zoom calls fitting that we're doing this conversation about Boberdam's inside on a zoom call on our right, oh, or my right. Well, since since we still have you, do you have any other ngs you want to talk about? I want to talk about that funny feeling. I want to talk about that funny feeling too. That's the now that hotepe thing. Oh, Randy, go. Okay, so I have a passage that I'm going to read here from HP lovecrafts short story. Oh, sorry, you just said it's from HP love crafts. Sure, story. Yeah, I just had a heart up the church and being like they read lovecraft and Church that's yeah, Badass, Cool Randy. Okay, so that funny feeling is exactly the song that that makes me want to talk about this. I do not recall distinctly when it began, but it was months ago. The general tension was horrible. To a season of political and social upheaval was added a strange and brooding apprehension of hideous physical danger, a danger widespread and all embracing, such a danger as maybe imagine only in the most terrible phantasms of the night. I recall that the people went about with Pale and worried faces and whispered warnings and prophecies which no one dared consciously repeat or acknowledged to himself that he had heard. A sense of monstrous guilt was upon the land and out of the abysses between the stars swept chill currents that made men shiver in dark and lonely places. There was a demoniac alteration in the sequence of the seasons. The autumn heat lingered fearsomely and everyone felt that the world, and perhaps the universe, had passed from the control of known gods or forces to that of Gods or forces which were unknown. Yeah, it also ties a little bit into all eyes on me with, you know, the oceans rising all that. But in the lyrics of that funny feeling, you know, he mentions on apparent summer air and early fall, things like that apprehension and the ending of it all. Yeah, so I have this like little pet theory that I'm working on. I wanted to try and get an episode together about it sometime. But there's a reason that he made a set of a camp fire for that song, right, you know, there's there's a reason that it's a folk song. There's a reason that you know, has the fire crackling because, like, I think it's I think it's meant to reach into that part of view that like kind of primal peeple. Stupid people say like the reptile brain and stuff, and I'll be I'll be one of those people. I'll be I'll be that guy today. Stupid Gut number one. Actually, it's reachching into my fish brain, Fisher the reptiles of the sea. I think that...

...to oak created also the reptiles of the sea. You have a turtles can be on Lane's say fuck you, idiot. Turtles shown up to my podcast, showing me up. This reminds me of when I was a child and I was watching that episode of full house where Uncle Jesse she got a turtle and it was really probably a tortist anyway, but he just kept going I love that and Phibian and probably just the whole time, like, wait, turtles are reptiles, not amphibians. What the fuck is this supposed to be? Because I thought the episode was supposed to make Uncle Jesse look kind of cool, but it made them look kind of stupid and I didn't know if it was like the writers or Uncle Jesse. That was like the long yeah, morally role. I hope you a bit in the podcast. If Anything, Oh, don't worry, we can't afford to cut the good. I think all the problematics have happened in the last one, so we don't have to cut much from this one. Wonderful. So, yeah, you were saying the camp for yeah, well, yeah, I think I think I'm mortal. I'm just saying that. I don't think it's a coincidence that this song and that visual go together and I don't know if that's I don't know if like I don't know if like Bo Burnham and I have the same feeling about a campfire and that it it reaches back into, you know, something that David Lynch would call like the deepest well springs of our being. But I think, I think it does have that like kind of like nobody can argue with Bob Dylan right, even if you want to, because I don't know, there's just something about a folks on, there's something about a campfire. I just think it's like a perfect synthesis of medium message and setting. Well, campfire is what kind of we come from in terms of like where we make music, but it's also what's going to be left if the shit in that song happens, if the gods really, the new gods really do take over. I mean that's where we're going to be singing. It's around the campfire. I think there's I didn't I thought that's what you're going to say. In fact, I hadn't thought of it until you started talking. Well, okay, so in cut, damn, I hate to keep quoting a racist guy, but in the call of cthulh, you know, he talks about like after the apocalypse, you know, we were we are going to figure out all new ways to like scream and revel and enjoy ourselves. And I don't know, there's there is that feeling. You know, what can you say? What can you say? We were overdue, it'll be over soon. And and he but he's scatting on top of that. Yeah, I want to say. So I was going to say like the beginning where he starts out with like Oh, you know, I don't I'm not very good at singing or playing guitar. Well, that's classic guitar to Camp Fire. Right, exactly, classic guitar to Campfire, but also like don't expect too much. And then he comes out with this like very profound like song. Yeah, perfect message. And then at the end, right, it just switches to like that like uplifting Campfire Song, like, you know, what do you say? We were overdue. Oh well, all the things I said. Yeah, they suck, but well, I think it's the purest, the purest like feeling of melancholy that he gets you to the entire time. That that combination of like oh well, plus like, like you said, uplifting music, because to me the overall feeling is not uplifting but sad. But like it's sad because of how uplifting the music sounds you know what I mean. Yeah, I think. I think somewhere between this song and all eyes on me, I think the thesis for this special is going to be found. I don't know, just for me, I think. I think this was the the the real highlight. Yeah, it's a perfect or two of like the spectacle, if we're going with that theory that this is actually about the society of the spectacle, where like he's like when he says female Colonel Sanders, easy answers, I'm just like, oh my goodness. And the awareness thing, I'm just like the fact that there's we're people are like, Oh yeah, this capitalist company, this company that has a monopoly on this product, cares about this social issue. That makes me feel real good. Is a consumer that's on need wow about he doesn't eat.

Doesn't even really address it in the song. But how about the irony of Pepsi Halftime Show Right? Pepsi did that add with Kendall? Pepsi did the ad with Kendall Jenner where they like basically just did a parody of a black lives matter protest and like police brutality exhibition. And of course the NFL is the the governing body that like decided we we're gonna like put a stop to Colin Kaepernick, right, and he doesn't even he doesn't even address it, but it's there. It's palpable. Go ahead. or on the subject, by the way, boycott, boycott freed to lay, which is owned by Pepsico. So Boycott Pepsico. If you want to support freed lay workers who are striking right now. Always Boycott Pepsi Coo, or is it co? Also? All we have Pepsi Coo freed to lay, specifically right now, more so even than boycott right just like maybe share an article or some shit. Will do what little thing you can, because they also owned to Sawny, they own they own Caveto, which is the worst COMBOCHA company where. It's like people are like, Boycott Amazon. Do you know how many companies Jeff Bezos owns? Your owns, I am DB. You ownst likes post like like the it's just a meaningless saying. It's like, Oh, boycott Amazon, Oh Haha, you're like better if you do this thing, if you avoid buying this product. You don't. You See, like yeah, you should try not to buy that product, but like you can't escape. How many things are bad. You can't be perfect. You you can't judge other people for doing things that are kind of Shitty, because there's shitty things that you're doing that you don't even know about and you can't know about because all of its shitty. It's all shitty. That's the point. Like you can't escape it. You rely so heavily on it that you can't do anything about it. You have to become like an amprim. Yeah, fuck that. Yeah, yeah, I mean, I mean it's not the worst thing. Yeah, I'm not going to become an imprim before I have no choice, you know what I mean? They're easier ways to realize you're holding a compost Toilett, to be honest. On the other hand, maybe we should become amprims before we have no choice. I mean it's it's so crazy to me that like peps, he's like an Mlm of like, but what they say is just being problematic all the time and the entry level is quicksand it like free too lays. It's bad enough, right. I have like all kinds of free too lay products in my house. I've a des honey is like me too, sure. I mean, I have like an almost finished bag of cheetos that I'm like, I don't feel good about eating this, or, you know, I go to chick fil a, like how much of what I give to Chickfila is going to like what is it called conversion therapy? But the thing about companies I was just I was talking about Chick Fila and hobby lobby today and there is something about those company. Would Hobby lobby do? Oh, same, but also like they did, I helped. They don't deny contraception to their employees and I think they've lobbied to the hobby lobby. Lobby has, like the hobby lobbyists, I think, put money into to like keeping that out of healthcare and this in certain states. It gets to a point where I'm like, okay, a chickful a, like we already know capitalism is bad. We can assume that the politics of your company are bad. It's going to be bad, we know. But there's no such thing as like a feminist company or like right, exactly a lie. The female Colonel Sanders thing is so ironic and it's funny. Like to all just to be openly fucking homophobic is so fucking bold, like fuck that, like but it's good chicken? Why? And where else you're gonna get waffle fries? I mean, I I feel mixed feelings because I'm like, on the one hand, if you go anywhere else, you're just ignoring the act that the owner of their company is probably homophobic. Um, but the fact that it's, if not the owner than the majority. Yeah, the fact that it's out there. It's like, come on, that the bar is so low, you know, like please at least so let us ignore this fact. But it's almost a statement, the fact that that it's out there. It's a statement to how little anyone really cares, because we just know that like it doesn't even matter because all of them suck.

It's almost impossible to like actualize caring, though, on the level of branding. It's impossible, I think. Truly it's if you live in a food desert, which most people do. I that yeah, like, what are you going to do? How do you get away from to Sani if you don't have pot of water that comes out of your faucet? I have to buy bottled water right, absolutely, even even when I was paying eight hundred dollars a month in rent, I had to buy bottled water. Because I couldn't drink what came out of Fawcet. The fact that that buying has been that it's the we can even think the thought that like buying something is akin to caring. Really does it disservice to the idea of caring to be a little bit it's not. You know, of course I get wrapped up in this ideology of the consumer, the default consumer ideology to like in small ways. No way that you're made to feel bad about it's not like, Oh, you should feel bad about this because you don't really have a choice. The way they're made to feel bad about it is like, Oh, you know the whole you know the Coca Cola thing, where you know the Cocacola comp company, the plant in India was poisoning the ground water and poisoning people who lived near the factory, and or like with boycott Nike. Nike, you know, exploits its workers and that's why you should feel bad about it. But for some yeah, or cocacola again, like hiring mercenaries to kill union leaders or Chikda. Right, it's just pointing a finger at one company being like this is bad, you should feel bad because they're openly doing this thing that's so bad, or they were exposed, but for some reason it's okay for you to buy this other similar thing. And instead of being like, I feel bad because I have very little choice as a consumer and this whole the whole idea of caring about what you are buying is a class issue, and instead it's like you're supposed to feel bad no matter what, because the people who are actually feeling the up close like effects of this product and this company are live in the global south and are being poisoned or exploited. And but it's like now you boycott palm oil. Yeah, it's like the consumer responsibility is is a myth. There's a reality where you can acknowledge what you're buying and why it's bad. But don't be naive. All of it's bad. It's funny how, like certain staples, like certain essential goods, become like trendy, like evy on or something, or Fiji water. I remember from elementary school that like everybody like wanted feedi water m yeah, it's crazy how, like essential things become commodified in that way, become trends, when like the fact that the fact that like they're even importing. I mean, I'm sure they're not actually importing water from Fiji. Maybe, but how do you, how does somebody avoid like that level of exploitation? They are literally importing water from Fiji, which makes it all the more shocking. Is that okay? Yeah, but it's it's like next door to at the fucking tug hill right, don't isn't there? Like maybe I'm crazy. For some reason I feel like tug hill has water, like a water like distribution there there's a reservoir, but I don't know if it's being I don't know if it's being a private company owns the own the reserv world and maybe, I don't know, maybe I'm thinking of something else. Maybe maybe I'm confusing Poland spring for dug Hille or something. But yeah, but that's a real one. That's in Massachusetts, I guess, or by the Dada. Everybody say goodbye to Lydia, the.

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